Hello everyone,

I am in a situation where my life feels like a complete mess, never had a job, broke and indebted, stuck in dysfunctional 10 year relationship, depressed, and it's unlikely I will ever graduate from university (failing most tests). I think you can assume low self-esteem is the root to all of it.

I feel I can't expand my social circle, because when you talk with people, life situation and career always comes up and that's when people start to shun me, because I have nothing to offer. I'm 29 turning 30 soon and somehow people just expect that you have things figured out by then.

I feel like being honest about one's situation and making yourself vulnerable that way, is only allowed if you already lead an amazing life and have the achievements to show (the travelling experience, expertise in an art form, socially acceptable hobbies, interesting acquaintances).

Can't join any classes, because that cost money, can't go out - no money, can't even get a therapy because that costs money, too. Applications for a job get turned down, because your empty resume paints you as a shady character (we need someone with more experience). I have two friends, who I think have a cool lifestyle and have large social circles, but it came to them relatively easy ("Naturals", so there's no life lessons I actually could learn from them, because they didn't have to put in any effort and they're even younger than me). So at social gatherings, next to them, I appear even more awkward, plus I have this reputation of being "creepy" with women, since I tried to become more social by doing cold approaching.

It's all a vicious circle somehow: no job -> no money -> social isolation -> low self-esteem -> no motivation -> no job

I have some hobbies, but never advanced beyond a total beginner level (I'm a procrastination expert though) and people seem to expect you to be good/skilled at your hobbies.

Do you have any advice, where to start to break the cycle? How to create positive life experiences that build confidence?
Or how to have a deep conversation where you don't incriminate yourself as a loser? And make people stick around? People don't simply associate themselves with you if you appear "broken" or irregular.

I want to make friends, meet girls and find passions, but I feel like my situation is slowly suffocating me.

norobot says: "thank you for reading".

p.s.: I live in Germany, some intricacies therefore, no campus, low tuition fees, a cap to how much you're allowed to earn as a student, high living costs.

You have to start from somewhere and build from it. Start simple. Get a job. Save. Build it up. It sounds like you have various ideas but no real grounding. Just start one job. Build some routine. Its not rocket science.

But at the same time, I know what you mean. I'm working at the moment. But its tough sometimes. I just get this self talk sometimes, I doubt that I will ever 'make it' in life. I doubt that I am naturally talented or intelligent.

But you have to somehow transform it and become positive. No one said it was easy.

Hi, welcome.
You're sure you can't get Social security to pay/help for your therapy, school counselling, or go to some support group? Take a good look at the options available for you.
4½ years ago I, too, though was depressed, started counselling with some Mental Health support association (for free.) I soon found out that I wasn't depressed, I was married... So I quit.

Actually, my story is a lot like yours, I had similar thoughs and views about myself, had no money, was always dragging on my friends when out, etc. I was lucky to have a good friend that took me in his house the day my ex kicked me out, weeks before I turned 30. Money wasn't enough to pay rent, I was also paying for my kids and paying the debt from my bankrupt company - I am still paying every month. I had a job - a menial job, that I am still doing to this day, despite having an university degree. At the beginning I had been warned of dismissal for being late at work, I later become a role employee.
I did interviews with search marketing companies but, despite my know how, they probably sensed a severe lack of self esteem.

I could go on and tell you about many other difficulties, that I had or still have, that quite match yours, but the point is that your situation is not unbearable. What I regret the most is not going back to my master studies earlier and not taking on therapy before. I been moving forward all the time, but when I see it, I can't avoid feeling disappointed for taking so small steps.

Currently, I am starting with my thesis, have girls that I see regularly, a great relationship with my kids, doing therapy (the second gift from my ex, after the divorce) and when the weekend comes my friends call and want to hang out with me.
I still find it pretty hard to relate to people who have found their career paths and are way ahead of me. I believe it is a pre-requisite for me, before I find a satisfactory job, to come to terms with my underachievement and accept myself. I don't think most people want to judge or look me down, nor will they judge. Unless I do it first, that is.
They are just as lost as we are, you know? Sometimes they can't even give themselves the excuses you and I have... Take a look at this speech ans see if it inspires you:
http://www.practicalpickup.com/this-is-water

1) you need a support structure. Seek out some organization or group of people who are commited to change.
2) find one activity that you will do every day, no matter what. This begins the process of re-establishing control over urself. The activity can be as simple as going for a walk everyday. It should be a new activity, something that you don't already do everyday by force of habit like taking a shower (I hope ).

Of the two, 1 is more important to prevent regressing back to old patterns.

Perhaps low self esteem is the root. But perhaps the problems are the root of the low self esteem.
It's like asking if the chicken or the egg came first and it really doesn't matter.

Either way, you need to find a passion to work towards. At this moment, women should be the last of your concerns. Go out with MALE friends and behave as if you absolutely do not care about getting laid. You'll start doing things more true to yourself and it will help you to live in the moment.

You'll begin to find motivation to yourself and responsibility for your own happiness. If you have no skills or talents you must begin to develop them. If you've procrastinated on those things as you say then that is your own fault. Take responsibility for your lifestyle. Disconnect from the internet entirely and start reading textbooks on fascinating topics in your spare time FOR FUN! Find something you can punch, like obviously a big punching bag for stress relief. And finally, you ABSOLUTELY MUST EXERCISE and EAT HEALTHY. Not as a diet, or as a boost; do it as a PERMANENT LIFE CHANGE. Figure out what you're going to eat and do for a workout and do that for the rest of your life.

Read one of the help books then STOP reading and start thinking about other things.

Study the things you actually find interesting and passion will come to you. Behave as if you would as if women didn't even exist, and you'll find a weight lifted from your shoulders (and quite ironically, this will be an important step in eventually becoming more attractive to women)

I'm not exactly a life expert and have never been in so much trouble. But I know someone who had to build up from zero after he got out from jail, let's call him Hugh.

1. get money (preferrably not in an illegal way): find a job (whatever, cleaning, serving, ... it doesn't really matter, it's temporary anyway), try to get some financial support from social security or you parents. You can't go without any money.
2. start re-exploring your hobbies or find a new hobby. Hugh started playing guitar after jail. Make sure you really enjoy it and completely are absorbed by the process, so you forget whatever shit is on your mind. If your hobby is not really social (like guitar playing), take some lessons (here's where the money would be handy), if it's possible. Or you can take a social hobby (like dancing). You need to come in contact with people. It (re)builds social confidence.

And when you've saved up enough money, you can go study and get a profession. Probably you'd have to work part time during the studies. It's hard, but "no pain, no gain".

Maybe during your hobby classes, you meet some girl. Otherwise, you could meet many girls when you'll be studying.

But you already knew all that. You just have to start doing something NOW.

I agree with Denis. You have to start with becoming financially stable. There's a good chance you have depression or other issues going on. But money comes first. I know this is easy for me to say, but here's what I'd do in your position:

- Get as many jobs as I could stomach. Doesn't matter if it's mopping floors, serving coffee, washing windows, etc. I'd get at least two jobs. And I'd challenge myself to be absolutely perfect at each of those jobs. Be exemplary. Show up early. Leave late. Do extra work that's unasked for. Be more efficient than all of your co-workers.

What this does: 1) allows you to save money, 2) gets you valuable work experience for your resume, 3) builds a good reputation with employers, and 4) builds your confidence as you go out and accomplish what you set out to do each day.

- Save up all of the money. If I felt I had some serious emotional stuff going on, I'd spend some money on a therapist. But other than that, life would be work and save for a solid year at least. No new TV. No car. No XBox. Just work. One job during the day, one in the evening, and possibly one on the weekend.

- After a year, you should have money in the bank and a handful of employers who think you're amazing. You may have already gotten some sort of promotion by now. Take that money and sign up for classes (if necessary) or use your new connections to get a "real" job. When I say classes, I don't mean print-making or Romantic Literature. I mean something like computer science, web development, network administration, etc. Something that will be easy to get a decent job in.

- Again, I'd challenge myself to be the best student in the class. Show up early. Stay late. Meet with the teacher, get to know him. Set aside time to study every single day. This is your life. I mean that literally... make this your life.

- Eventually, after enough time, once you're somewhat happy with where your career is going, and once you feel like you've got a handle on doing good work consistently without fucking around, then start worrying about friends and social circle, women, etc.

(10-12-2011 10:00 PM)norobot Wrote:  I'm 29 turning 30 soon and somehow people just expect that you have things figured out by then.

Lol! I must be in serious problems then 'cause I'm 39 y-o and I'm just starting to understand myself. Some people never do it. There's a saying in my country that goes like this: Life starts when you are 40 y-o.
I think it is true.
Don't be so hard on yourself, have some compassion for yourself. And yeah, look for some professional help, must be something for free.
Good luck!

(10-17-2011 03:43 PM)Mark Wrote:  I agree with Denis. You have to start with becoming financially stable. There's a good chance you have depression or other issues going on. But money comes first. I know this is easy for me to say, but here's what I'd do in your position:

- Get as many jobs as I could stomach. Doesn't matter if it's mopping floors, serving coffee, washing windows, etc. I'd get at least two jobs. And I'd challenge myself to be absolutely perfect at each of those jobs. Be exemplary. Show up early. Leave late. Do extra work that's unasked for. Be more efficient than all of your co-workers.

What this does: 1) allows you to save money, 2) gets you valuable work experience for your resume, 3) builds a good reputation with employers, and 4) builds your confidence as you go out and accomplish what you set out to do each day.

- Save up all of the money. If I felt I had some serious emotional stuff going on, I'd spend some money on a therapist. But other than that, life would be work and save for a solid year at least. No new TV. No car. No XBox. Just work. One job during the day, one in the evening, and possibly one on the weekend.

- After a year, you should have money in the bank and a handful of employers who think you're amazing. You may have already gotten some sort of promotion by now. Take that money and sign up for classes (if necessary) or use your new connections to get a "real" job. When I say classes, I don't mean print-making or Romantic Literature. I mean something like computer science, web development, network administration, etc. Something that will be easy to get a decent job in.

- Again, I'd challenge myself to be the best student in the class. Show up early. Stay late. Meet with the teacher, get to know him. Set aside time to study every single day. This is your life. I mean that literally... make this your life.

- Eventually, after enough time, once you're somewhat happy with where your career is going, and once you feel like you've got a handle on doing good work consistently without fucking around, then start worrying about friends and social circle, women, etc.

Good advice. Except I think (at least for me), this would be a good recipe for a mini-burnout/depression. Like James Howell wrote: "All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy".

Mark's advice is great. I'd also add that if you stick to it, you might find that without even trying, you start making some friends.