Hey guys, i've been thinking a lot lately about a mans relationship with his father and how this affects his relationship with woman. I know everyone talks a lot about relationships with the mother, but if attracting and relating to woman is all about being a high quality man, then there's no more important role model a man has in his life than his Father. Was curious about everyones relationships with their Dad and if you think it effected the way you interact and relate to woman, and if so, how? Haha, personal, I know, but I think if we're getting the roots of our masculinity its worth asking. I know for me, i'm extremely fortunate to have an amazing father who taught me pretty much everything about being a man...except how to deal with woman. Not holding any grudges, but I definitely think my being a LATE bloomer has a lot to do with that.

The point is to have some kind of male role model growing up. For most people, it's their father, but honestly, you dont need a father to be good with women.

One of my natural friend with over 400 lays dont even HAVE a father growing up. But he's black and he's surrounded by other natural black guys who indirectly transform him into becoming an attractive guy.

If your relationship with your father suck, go out find guy friends who are good with women. Stop blaming your father. The past is the past.

(08-11-2011 01:52 AM)Brian Wrote:  If your relationship with your father suck, go out find guy friends who are good with women. Stop blaming your father. The past is the past.

Prrretty sure that's not what i'm getting at. But, um, thanx??

I'm more interested in how your guy's upbringing with your Dad's impacted and shaped your perceptions towards woman as you developed into adulthood. I simply think this is an interesting point to look at, not an opportunity to lay blame.

(08-11-2011 01:52 AM)Brian Wrote:  One of my natural friend with over 400 lays dont even HAVE a father growing up. But he's black and he's surrounded by other natural black guys who indirectly transform him into becoming an attractive guy.

I'm looking forward to your forthcoming ebook The "My Natural Black Friend With Over 400 Lays" Method.

Yes, it cost 9.99. Comes with a free penis so you can put it in your mouth.

I think this is a great topic, something I've been interested in for a long time now.

I make a point to always ask my clients about their relationships with both their parents. I've noticed that most sticking points can be traced out to something relating to their relationship with their mother or father (or lack thereof).

Relationship with the father determines just about everything as it relates to masculinity. He's your male role model. He validates you as a man as well. And that validation is huge. You can find other role models, but it's very very hard to get that validation that a father gives his son. Believe it or not, Brian's super 400-lay natural friend is relevant here. What I've noticed is that it's actually the guys who LACK father-figures who feel a need to fuck 400 women. Guys who grew up with a healthy relationship with their dad almost never feel compelled to do that. It's the guys who lacked a relationship with a father growing up who develop an obsession of proving their masculinity over and over and over again. They need that validation they never got as a child.

Many guys in the PUA are the same way. I've found that almost everyone in PUA has either a distant relationship with their father or no relationship with them. This causes two things: 1) an inability to express masculinity, hence learning game, and 2) an overwhelming desire to PROVE your masculinity, i.e., fuck tons and tons of girls.

Most guys get satiated at some point, whether it's 5 lays, 10 lays, 50 lays or 100 lays. But a small handful become addicted and never get out of it. They become obsessed with fucking any and everything. These are usually the guys who come from the most damaged relationships.

Of course mother comes into it as well, but that relates to other stuff.

I also think that more guys have troubled relationships with their fathers than with their mothers, which is a sad comment on men of our parents' generation. My roommate, who works in film, pointed out that a huge number of movies follow an archetype formula where the protagonist starts as an orphan, becomes a wanderer, than a warrior, then a martyr. It's shocking the number of movies where the protagonist is either metaphorically or even literally an orphan. Spiderman (twice over), batman, superman (twice over), luke skywalker (three or arguably four times over), vito corleone, michael corleone, harry potter, john connor, the dude from pirates of the carrabean, simba from the lion king.

Edit: if you think about it with star wars, the number of times luke is literally or metaphorically orphaned is comical. He starts off thinking his father is dead. Then his adoptive parents get killed, then his mentor gets killed, then his father's memory is destroyed when he finds out his father becomes vader, then his other mentor dies, then his father redeems himself just in time to die for real.

And then Luke went out and fucked 400 chicks with his jedi powers....

(08-11-2011 11:33 AM)Mark Wrote:  Many guys in the PUA are the same way. I've found that almost everyone in PUA has either a distant relationship with their father or no relationship with them. This causes two things: 1) an inability to express masculinity, hence learning game, and 2) an overwhelming desire to PROVE your masculinity, i.e., fuck tons and tons of girls.

*raises hand because that's probably me in some respects. And I suspect that some of the guys I've hung out with for awhile that are into pickup have the same problem. I met a guy who has been doing pickup for 10 freaking years and still has that need to brag about stuff that's happened to him. For some people, it's like a lack of self-awareness that prevents them from asking what the root causes of the constant need to chase ass when they've had plenty of sexual experiences/girlfriends/FBs and should know WTF they want by now.

I too, had a black natural roommate friend/frat brother in college and I always wondered "What's driving this guy?" because although he would occasionally bring home an attractive girl, sometimes the girl would be hideous and it was like he didn't care. He had a cute girlfriend and would cheat on her with girls waay below her caliber in both personality and looks. He even had a cardboard poster with girl's names that he had sex with.

I had another roommate/frat brother who had slightly higher standards but he was basically the same way. But he ended up settling down and getting married. What did the two have in common? Absent fathers. Matter of fact, I think the thing that bonded us all in a way and made us join the frat was our need for male validation due to either absentee dads or distant/critical dads (my case).

Interesting subject,

I think for me it's somewhat the oposite of what Mark said.. or well.. anyway it's somewhat the same result.

My father wasn't really there... or well, he wasn't at home often because of work, but, when he was home, he was there. But the thing is, ever since I've started high school, I feel like, all I did was approved of by my dad... It's almost like I had so much validation from him that it really doesn't matter anymore. Almost like, "well, I must be better than he his.. so why would I want it's validation"... and although I came to terms with that now. Partly by working on myself, and partly because he stopped drinking...

that said, in how it does relate to woman... well, I think he must've tried to talk to me about it... but it must've been awkward.. and, I think that basically his technique was to get drunk and let everything happen, which is not really a good advice...

And we're such different people, probably less, because, I discovered that the more I age, the more I'm interested in stuff that he likes.. and in manly stuff.. (owning a drill, a skillsaw.. well tools.. and using them) which I didn't really like back then.

but back to women... I think that the "overvalidation" or "lack of value in the validation" lead me to apathy.. like I don't really care for validation from other guys.... or, well I'd like it, but being "safe" is more important to me. Well, that, coupled with the fact that I really didn't knew what to do with women, and that I wasn't considered to be cool.

But I really do think that the worst thing for me was being a loner through most of school, except the end of college and university.

But that's out of subject here.

To sum up, I think that the lack of value I used to put into my father's validation somehow lead me to disregard the validation that other men can bring to me... but like I said, it's less worse now, in fact, before I used to get along way better with my mother than my father, and it's not really the case anymore. Nowadays, when I visit home, it seems kinda selfish to say that, but I prefer to spend time with my father, doing man stuff...