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RE: Re: China as an emerging power - Harry Potter - 09-26-2011 09:48 PM
(09-26-2011 08:47 AM)General G Wrote: You have to look at this from a broader historical perspective.
There have been economic and political links between China and the West since the Roman Times. Han China was an empire at least as mighty as the Imperium Romanum.
During the middle ages, and even in early modern times, some economic historians say until 1800, China was politically and economically stronger than any European state.
The power dynamic between China and the West shifted greatly because of the Opium Wars (1840s/50s), the Taiping Revolution (20 million dead), the great hunger of 1878/1898, the Boxer uprising (1900) etc.
That the Chinese are "coming back" since Deng Xiaoping's reforms is nothing new. One just needs to put it in a broader perspective.
Well, actually IMO China fell behind during the Ming Dynasty when they allowed their technology to stagnate while the West accelerated technological development. Some racists might attribute this to a lack of innovation among Asians but it's mainly due to the political climate not being accepting of innovations, especially after the rise of neo-Confucianism.
RE: China as an emerging power - jcxky - 09-27-2011 11:26 PM
(09-26-2011 09:48 PM)Harry Potter Wrote:So then how do you explain Chinese rampant stealing, piracy, and theft of U.S commercial & military technology, as well as that of Russia's and European countries? You can't make excuses blaming neo-Confucianism when the Chinese overseas and domestic had decades to think and come up with something on their own. They haven't really. All of their current armaments have been stolen and copied from elsewhere, their jets, Tanks, and ships, their entire military is are based off of either U.S or Russian tech cold war. You can make the exception that they are building new technologies atop stolen Western technology, but then that's not an exception because the innovation built atop is nothing ground breaking and nothing out of the potential of any Western country. You also can't make excuses blaming history for why China or the Chinese haven't been able to come up with anything on their own in the past decade, U.S or elsewhere. No Chinese person has come up with Facebook, Jazz, Internet portals, or anything of that sorts.(09-26-2011 08:47 AM)General G Wrote: You have to look at this from a broader historical perspective.
There have been economic and political links between China and the West since the Roman Times. Han China was an empire at least as mighty as the Imperium Romanum.
During the middle ages, and even in early modern times, some economic historians say until 1800, China was politically and economically stronger than any European state.
The power dynamic between China and the West shifted greatly because of the Opium Wars (1840s/50s), the Taiping Revolution (20 million dead), the great hunger of 1878/1898, the Boxer uprising (1900) etc.
That the Chinese are "coming back" since Deng Xiaoping's reforms is nothing new. One just needs to put it in a broader perspective.
Well, actually IMO China fell behind during the Ming Dynasty when they allowed their technology to stagnate while the West accelerated technological development. Some racists might attribute this to a lack of innovation among Asians but it's mainly due to the political climate not being accepting of innovations, especially after the rise of neo-Confucianism.
RE: Re: China as an emerging power - Harry Potter - 09-28-2011 01:42 AM
The contents of this message are hidden because jcxky is on your ignore list.
RE: Re: China as an emerging power - Gill - 09-28-2011 07:46 AM
Well, China had many troubled past. From the drug war with the britains when they lost Hong-Kong to the 8 nations war. Then Mao came and destroyed 100 years of culture and knowledge... No historic excuses, but also a good way to understand one thing : China simply needs to fil their gap, and their economic rise is perfectly normal since they need to built/rebuilt almost everything like any nation did (Singapour, Taiwan, South Korea). Blocking the social network, refusing big majors to come into "strategic economic domain" (Google, Danone, Facebook etc...) is also perfectly logic in order to develop their own market before letting them compete. In France, it's the same (national firm for the water + electricity) like in any other nations. China is not hungry for "power", but rather to feed 1,6 billions people and maintain a social "harmony" and make countryside co-exist with major cities without trouble (which a lot of people easily associate with censoring).
However, you can't also deny the threats they can issue : the yuan/dollars balance currency for their export, as well as their social policy (one sole child per family) is going to be a real problem to deal when the economic growth will cease...
For anyone interested, nice forecast done there :
RE: China as an emerging power - shadow - 09-28-2011 01:25 PM
(09-28-2011 01:42 AM)Harry Potter Wrote: The contents of this message are hidden because jcxky is on your ignore list.
Haha. Some people are consumed by their hatred. The very thought of China making progress is scary to him.
RE: Re: China as an emerging power - Mark - 09-28-2011 09:16 PM
I love how his argument against China is that they pirate DVD's, didn't invent Facebook and based their military off ours. When really you could say the same thing for every non-Western country on the entire planet. Very scholarly arguments. Very persuasive. lol...
Anyway... thread locked. Thanks for playing.